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Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'? 
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

d.mimøsa wrote:
So, in one sentence, fulfilment for you is primarily a question of attitude rather than a matter of specific factors which need to be present - does that sound about right?


Close enough, perhaps. I think it's actually slightly more remote than that, in that attitude selects for and determines which activities I'll undertake, the consequences of which are small chunks of fulfilment that add up to a total sense of value.
Bapho says something similar (but in a much gloomier way) with:
baphomet wrote:
There is no possible fulfilment; there are bits of if, scattered here and there, a collection of short joys, of small contentments and satisfactions that together, when added, makes a life not too hard to bear.

I'm just adding my joys, contentments and satisfactions to a basic state of 'life's actually pretty easy to bear'.

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Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:21 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

baphomet wrote:
one: find someone to love and be loved by. This is basics. This gives meaning, whatever it can be. Although as an individual you're still be alone in yourself, you won't be alone outside of yourself. This is mental support, intellectual exchanges, plans that you couldn't achieve by yourself, this is also increased material comfort, what can't be neglected, as can't be the overall euphoric effects.
two: find yourself some responsabilties to carry on that YOU find important. It can be political, it can be ideological, it can be those, simple ones, that result from a job you like. The meaning comes from the interest you put in it.
three: cultivate yourself, read, watch interesting movies, attend exhibitions, and make art in the broad sense of the term one the most important axis of your life.
four: realize life is short, meaningless, think about your own death often, watch in the eye the abjection of the world and try to be better than the vast majority of men.

Basically, most of this pretty much corresponds to what I've been pursuing for most of my life. There's a part of me that still wants to hold on to, and believe in, these ideals, but the better part of me is finally realising I've been on a wild goose chase and these things simply don't work out for me for a variety of reasons. Thus the question I have to ask myself is: can I find any realistic alternatives that won't feel like cheap substitutes? After all, much of what you've written has always been an integral part of my identity, or let's say: self-image. And I'd like to believe that not all of that self-image was merely an arbitrary construction; there's an essential core to it that will never cease to exist no matter how much I change about my ways or my attitude. Consequently, I strongly doubt that leaving these things behind will really work out in the long run, no matter how rational and well-founded the reasons may be. But there is one clear thing I have already achieved: I no longer perceive those axioms as absolutes (which takes us back to the question of attitude), and I have found a deeper appreciation for what I already have or what I actually can achieve (which may not be much, but at least it's something).

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Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:30 pm
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baphomet wrote:
let me give you a few of tips if you want to make your life not only more bearable, but also more meaningful...

one: find someone to love and be loved by. This is basics. This gives meaning, whatever it can be. Although as an individual you're still be alone in yourself, you won't be alone outside of yourself. This is mental support, intellectual exchanges, plans that you couldn't achieve by yourself, this is also increased material comfort, what can't be neglected, as can't be the overall euphoric effects.
two: find yourself some responsabilties to carry on that YOU find important. It can be political, it can be ideological, it can be those, simple ones, that result from a job you like. The meaning comes from the interest you put in it.
three: cultivate yourself, read, watch interesting movies, attend exhibitions, and make art in the broad sense of the term one the most important axis of your life.
four: realize life is short, meaningless, think about your own death often, watch in the eye the abjection of the world and try to be better than the vast majority of men.

There is no possible fulfilment; there are bits of if, scattered here and there, a collection of short joys, of small contentments and satisfactions that together, when added, makes a life not too hard to bear.

Or embrace Bouddism and become a new Siddhartah, many have tried.



who's the old man, now? :p :dooom: no, really, wise words... do you have a beard?

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Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:48 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

haha, yes! And a big bald patch too! :D






:rainy:

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Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:17 am
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

I'm sporting a nice white beard at the moment... it's coming off today, though... I've still got all of my hair... :D

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Wed Feb 19, 2014 8:37 am
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Wow. I don't have that much hair left now, compared to a few months ago, but of course I always have my beard. :cool:

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Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:06 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

Typical: again it was just the four of us posting, even though this is a topic that should concern anyone, no matter whether they prefer Traditional or Extrem Doom (or R'n'B for that matter). From Aldo to Zuchowski, from Cruel Shoes to Skoms, they should all be joining the party and share some wisdom (or folly, depending on your perspective).

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Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:54 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

baphomet wrote:
one: find someone to love and be loved by. This is basics. This gives meaning, whatever it can be. Although as an individual you're still be alone in yourself, you won't be alone outside of yourself. This is mental support, intellectual exchanges, plans that you couldn't achieve by yourself, this is also increased material comfort, what can't be neglected, as can't be the overall euphoric effects.
two: find yourself some responsabilties to carry on that YOU find important. It can be political, it can be ideological, it can be those, simple ones, that result from a job you like. The meaning comes from the interest you put in it.
three: cultivate yourself, read, watch interesting movies, attend exhibitions, and make art in the broad sense of the term one the most important axis of your life.
four: realize life is short, meaningless, think about your own death often, watch in the eye the abjection of the world and try to be better than the vast majority of men.

There is no possible fulfilment; there are bits of if, scattered here and there, a collection of short joys, of small contentments and satisfactions that together, when added, makes a life not too hard to bear.



I think I've just found my spiritual guide. :worship:

I would only change point three a tiny little bit by including the importance of travel. It literally broadens your mind.

And give second chances. To everyone; your parents, your friends, life and - last but not least - yourself.

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Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:18 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

I was having a long walk this afternoon; around a place I didn't know and I was a bit disappointed, at some point, around 17:30, to get close to the highway - too much noise, too many cars. Then, the sun that was hidden by some low clouds untill that moment broke through: a quarter of an hour later, it cast its last gleams, an intense orange that set the nature ablaze. By that tiume, I had gained the woods again, and that was such a beautiful compensation, that big orange eye painting the hedges in red and covering the meadows with golden shades.

That to say that the contemplation of nature is also a simple but very rewarding experience. Life is worth nothing, but northing is worth life.

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Sat Feb 22, 2014 7:30 pm
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baphomet wrote:
I was having a long walk this afternoon; around a place I didn't know and I was a bit disappointed, at some point, around 17:30, to get close to the highway - too much noise, too many cars. Then, the sun that was hidden by some low clouds untill that moment broke through: a quarter of an hour later, it cast its last gleams, an intense orange that set the nature ablaze. By that tiume, I had gained the woods again, and that was such a beautiful compensation, that big orange eye painting the hedges in red and covering the meadows with golden shades.

That to say that the contemplation of nature is also a simple but very rewarding experience. Life is worth nothing, but northing is worth life.


you are an old hippie, really, aren't you... :laugh:

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Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:06 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

:yes-freak:


I still need a crappy dog with a bandana around the neck to walk along with me. I just have a fat cat at the moment.

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Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:38 am
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baphomet wrote:
:yes-freak:


I still need a crappy dog with a bandana around the neck to walk along with me. I just have a fat cat at the moment.



well, sort it out! :p

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Sun Feb 23, 2014 8:30 am
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baphomet wrote:
I was having a long walk this afternoon; around a place I didn't know and I was a bit disappointed, at some point, around 17:30, to get close to the highway - too much noise, too many cars. Then, the sun that was hidden by some low clouds untill that moment broke through: a quarter of an hour later, it cast its last gleams, an intense orange that set the nature ablaze. By that tiume, I had gained the woods again, and that was such a beautiful compensation, that big orange eye painting the hedges in red and covering the meadows with golden shades.

That to say that the contemplation of nature is also a simple but very rewarding experience. Life is worth nothing, but northing is worth life.

I've had very similar experiences on some of my hikes, both with regard to the disappointment and the positive surprise at the end, so I understand your point completely. And yes, these can be moments of temporary fulfilment indeed. What is more, the refuge of nature offers a welcome break from all the hassle and chaos of civilised life. When I'm outdoors at a pleasant spot, my stress level usually drops instantaneously. Through walking and enjoying the surroundings, I can get rid of unnecessarily negative thoughts and make way for new, more constructive ones. I'm really torn when it comes to the choice of a place to live since I love both nature and culture, but can't have both to equal extents: if I choose to live close to nature, it'll most likely be more difficult to participate in cultural activities; if, on the other hand, I stay in the urban centre, I won't have anything that can compensate for the stress. At the moment, I can enjoy the outdoors only rarely since I'd have to travel 40-60 minutes one way, which makes little sense if you just want to take a little walk of roughly the same duration.

Today the weather was so great that I took the bus down to the harbour to take a little stroll; I should have known better! The promenade was crowded with young couples, elderly people with their grandchildren and rich people with their spoiled dogs and/or expensive sports wear. Disgusting! I wouldn't have that problem if I lived somewhere with a forest nearby, for instance. On the other hand, my first flat was in one of the most remote districts of the town and there was plentiful of nature around (at least compared to now), but I felt even more isolated out there, plus there's always the above-mentioned problem with cultural activities.

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Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:45 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

If it's any help, I find I can avoid that sort of disappointment by never walking anywhere... :p

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Sun Feb 23, 2014 11:17 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

I wish I knew.

I'm not sure if it's me going through the ill-famed "midlife crisis" but the more time, the less enjoyment.

Music does bring its share of "happiness". Love, kids and sex too, art and movies also to a lesser extent, but ultimately they're like a bunch of stars in an otherwise black night. Not that my life is that grim and all. I can even say I'm pretty much sheltered and "blessed" compared to 90% of the world population, but maybe because of my education and all that free time I have, I dwell on things I shouldn't be dwelling on. Like 42 et al. If you know what I mean...

I'd like to be enlightened and fulfilled but I feel it is something out of (my) reach. If I were still with my "enlightened" American girlfriend, she'd probably say that it's just me being immature and she'd be fucking right (the bitch). But I'm afraid of becoming mature because it looks only like saying amen to all the shit things and accepting that life can trample all your fucking dreams.

So me bitching and refusing this "fulfillment" (acceptance of everything) is basically me trying to stay alive and not feel like I'm living a lucid dream on prozac. It hurts at times but I find it a better option than just maturely bending over. Maybe when my hormons level drop, I'll see the truth of acceptance and find my own fulfillment, until then I'll be just me.

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Fri Apr 04, 2014 2:53 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

vastAire wrote:
Like 42 et al.



You are a baby! :D

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Fri Apr 04, 2014 3:02 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

Hey old geezer, guess you didn't catch the reference then :p

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrases_from_The_Hitchhiker%27s_Guide_to_the_Galaxy#Answer_to_the_Ultimate_Question_of_Life.2C_the_Universe.2C_and_Everything_.2842.29

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Fri Apr 04, 2014 3:14 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

'course not... who do you think I am? Bapho? :D

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Fri Apr 04, 2014 3:26 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

I don't know that 'maturity' (whatever it's meant to mean) is a prerequisite to fulfilment, to be honest - I'm nearly 50 now, and despite having some burdens to carry - like earning a living - I don't really feel much less irresponsible and immature than when I was in my 20s.

I'm still fairly sure that the meaning of life is that there ain't no hidden meaning: might as well enjoy the ride, and it's a bonus if anybody cares once it's over. I'm not leaving a dynasty to carry on, or - at current rates - much of an undying legacy, either. But it's good enough to have lived an interesting, fairly privileged, sort of a life, met some good people and shared plenty of good times*.

* Not that I'm anticipating an exit anytime soon, even if it sounds that way. Just that whatever expectations I have for the future largely consist of more of the same sort of thing, and that'd be quietly satisfactory...

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Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:55 pm
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Post Re: Apart from music, what brings you 'fulfilment'?

I don't really qualify for the midlife crises yet, I suppose, but still I've made the same observation:
vastAire wrote:
the more time, the less enjoyment.[/quote

vastAire wrote:
Music does bring its share of "happiness". Love, kids and sex too, art and movies also to a lesser extent, but ultimately they're like a bunch of stars in an otherwise black night.

Music certainly is the most important star cluster, I also agree on films or good series; as for the rest, speak for yourself... :shrug: That's how experiences differ. The thing with 'love' is, in my experience: as long as it's absent, it's good at making you feel unfulfilled, but without necessarily changing that in any effective way once it's there. For those who have a chronically hard time finding it, it's definitely a inexhaustible source of frustration, and even more so after you've realised it couldn't possibly work out anyway. Kids are an entirely different matter again, at least for me - something that would probably warrant a dedicated thread. Suffice it to say the topic alone is yet another source of frustration for me personally, and no notion of fulfilment is associated with it. How people can perceive children as something positive is entirely beyond me (and, on the other hand, other people usually don't find much empathy for my position, either).

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Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:13 pm
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